Tao of Buttercup

What the Hell?

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Hell is the brutish state that is here all about us in the extremes within humanity.

 

It is a state of little light because the light is extinguished in the "righteousness" of those within it. Each in belief that theirs is the only way or no way.

 

It is the state of no way.

 

It is the state of I am right and you are wrong.

 

It is the state of political extremes - of any "side".

 

It is the state of "your a fucking idiot".

 

It is the state in which nothing grows and anyone's gain is someone's loss.

 

It is the place where the kind is a fool and the takers take and the victims wallow in shame.

 

It is base unfettered subjugation of all the life extinguishing proclivities.

 

It is a stepping point for most of us.

Edited by Spotless
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The hell I speak of is the same hell that is not of these bodies.

 

The religious version is that place where these proclivities rein not on this earthly plane.

 

Here on earth it is all intermixed within the big sleep and the un bounding consciousness.

On other planes these proclivities are not tolerated - they are isolated by vibration and clay.

 

There is no difference between the murderer and the decisive ass and the thief and the hoarder and the scum and the trickster.

No difference between them and the preacher that teaches hell and brim fire or the fool on the podium of atheism ranting dead thoughts.there is no difference between them an anyone mesmerized by the buzz that is them, the helpless and innocent lay among them.

 

The time spent there is in accordance with the obstinacy of ones proclivities. One can meet these here on Earth and settle with them or meet them there before going forward but met they must be. This is karma as long as we wish to be underneath the wheel - it is our choice.

Edited by Spotless

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Ironically, the German word 'hell' means 'light' (opposite of dark. 'Light' as in the opposite of heavy is 'leicht').

 

I wonder if there's any correlation to the English 'hell'?

 

German hell is 'Hölle' which sounds very similar when spoken.

 

It's like going into the light = going to hell ... weird, never thought of that before.

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Food for thought.

 

“What is hell? Hell is oneself.
Hell is alone, the other figures in it
Merely projections. There is nothing to escape from
And nothing to escape to. One is always alone.”

T.S. Eliot

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It's like going into the light = going to hell ... weird, never thought of that before.

And I suggest that you stop thinking of it that way.

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Food for thought.

 

“What is hell? Hell is oneself.

Hell is alone, the other figures in it

Merely projections. There is nothing to escape from

And nothing to escape to. One is always alone.”

T.S. Eliot

 

Eliot is a Smörgåsbord :)

 

This is the dead land

This is cactus land

Here the stone images

Are raised, here they receive

The supplication of a dead man’s hand

Under the twinkle of a fading star.

 

Is it like this

In death’s other kingdom

Waking alone

At the hour when we are

Trembling with tenderness

Lips that would kiss

Form prayers to broken stone.

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Ironically, the German word 'hell' means 'light' (opposite of dark. 'Light' as in the opposite of heavy is 'leicht').

 

I wonder if there's any correlation to the English 'hell'?

 

German hell is 'Hölle' which sounds very similar when spoken.

 

It's like going into the light = going to hell ... weird, never thought of that before.

 

 

Life is hell, going into the light is birth. (from the perspective of the infant, of course)

 

 

NO, DONT GO INTO THE LIGHT!

INSTEAD, FIND THE TRUTH!

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tongue in cheek comment: the newborn baby screaming his/her lungs out is the realization that he/she has arrived in hell :P

 

Many years ago I had some very good Bahai friends, and they were a tower of strength when things where 'hellish' !!! But I could not settle into the Bahai Faith, I've tried a few religions over the years but came to the conclusion that I am not suited to rituals and dogma!!!

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I've tried a few religions over the years but came to the conclusion that I am not suited to rituals and dogma!!!

 

Welcome to Dao :-)

 

you've got an awesome AV, btw.

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NO, DONT GO INTO THE LIGHT!

INSTEAD, FIND THE TRUTH!

But the truth is in the light, not in the darkness. Illusions and delusions live in the darkness. How else can one get enlightened if one does not go into the light?

Edited by Marblehead

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Light and Shade.

Ya gotta have both.

There can be some powerful lessons learnt in dark times.

Edited by GrandmasterP
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But the truth is in the light, not in the darkness. Illusions and delusions live in the darkness. How else can one get enlightened if one does not go into the light?

 

Therein lies the cryptic truth; that light is an illusion (as so much is, too, shadow)

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Taxes are too high!

Aint that the truth.

But if you are one of those who is getting the revenue from the taxes then it is likely that the taxes are not high enough.

 

And that's the truth too.

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Hehehe. Truth. Where can it be found? Not in our mind, that's for sure.

Thats a really good quirky question ,

to say its findable we'd need to determine what finding is,

but ,, Im thinking that all 'finding' perhaps requires ,

1 the thoughts of things not being as one might want , ( having dissatisfaction , untruth ,need etc)

2 the thoughts of things now being as one would want (not having dissatisfaction , untruth ,need etc)

Effort may or may not be required to 'find' things right?

 

Borrowing the perspective of the Tao itself , if it had perspective,

 

That which is , is , right?

That which is not , is not right?

Thats all there is and all that is not. right?

( Tao cant make a mistake or have an illusion ,don't you agree? )

So

There is no , ..'well somewhat it is , and perhaps a bit of it isnt..'

Nor is there any , 'things should be this other way but arent'

All things always ARE .( at least somewhere ! )

So no 'finding' happens from the perspective of Tao.

 

You and I on the other hand , can or do- have some self -preserving need , want , untruth ,injustice etc in our mind.

So any finding that may be done must be done by us , in our mind.

 

any holes in that?

Edited by Stosh

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WoW! Too many bats!

 

Yes, what is, is and what isn't, isn't but may become some 'what is'.

 

Yes, our mind exists but it plays tricks on us. Perhaps Tao likes a laugh now and again.

 

And I would agree with this:

Tao cant make a mistake or have an illusion ,don't you agree?

 

Is there such a things as seeing from the perspective on "no mind"? I think there is.

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But if you are one of those who is getting the revenue from the taxes then it is likely that the taxes are not high enough.

 

And that's the truth too.

 

Yep...

Light n Shade again.

Those tax dudes are shady coves and no mistake.

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WoW! Too many bats!

 

Yes, what is, is and what isn't, isn't but may become some 'what is'.

 

Yes, our mind exists but it plays tricks on us. Perhaps Tao likes a laugh now and again.

 

And I would agree with this:

Tao cant make a mistake or have an illusion ,don't you agree?

 

Is there such a things as seeing from the perspective on "no mind"? I think there is.

yes ... a camera has that ... just sitting there by itself.

 

But what exactly is 'no mind' ? Not sure ... but I 'think' I know what no mind isnt.

 

No mind isnt no mind, no mind is the absence of what should not be mind.

 

No mind is the way mind 'should' work ('original mind' ) .

 

No mind is not having the mind where it should not be.

 

It shouldn't be first in the psychological hierarchy .... thats the problem ...thinking our mind is running us ... we keep putting it up on that pedestal - of course, it cant deal with it, nor is it supposed to. So then it comes up with all these tricks to try and maintain its undeserved position.

 

A bit like a politician.

 

'If you dont put your mind anywhere it will pervade your whole body ... it is the warp that we disdain ... If you dont think of where to put it, the mind pervades the whole being. Placing the mind nowhere, employ your attention to each situation as it happens, according to what opponents do." - Takuan.

 

The fixated mind is what the warrior is to abandon.

 

if you have trouble with your mind 'throw it out' ( like the politician; from its position ... I am not advocating political assassination .... well, not until we have someone better and a better system to replace them with ).

 

" To think you will not think

Is also thinking of something,

Will you resolve not to think

Even of not thinking? " - Old proverb.

 

'We should enliven the mind without dwelling on anything.' - Doesnt some old scripture say that ?

 

No mind does not mean 'dont have a mind' , or that mind is insignificant or negligible but rather that is malleable, and workable.

 

"Shosan makes it clear that realisation of emptiness is not the goal of Zen, but the means by which to eliminate biased views and undesirable psychological complexes rooted in deceptions about the nature of reality."

 

- quotes from Thomas Cleary's ' The Japanese Art of War.'

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Nice response. But I have no idea where to go with it as I agree with what you have presented.

 

But I will say that what you spoke of is why I practice "empty-minded" meditation. With a little luck some of it will rub off into my conscious living.

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Is no mind then a medatative thing , or is it a wordless ( un artifact ed , genuine )?

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It's aspirational.

The mind is always there chattering away.

Learning how to deal with that pays dividends.

Edited by GrandmasterP
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