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How effective are the Taoist practices that you do?


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#1 AstralProjectee

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Posted 08 June 2012 - 10:51 PM

What have you been able to accomplish personally with the current techniques you are using?

Here are some examples.

How far are you spiritually?

Can you move energy around?

Can you open peoples chakras?

How powerful is the energy that you can build up?

Can you take peoples karma out of them put it into yourself and deal with it?

Then maybe you can say at the end how much further you know you can go with the current Taoist practices out there.

Thanks.

Peace!

#2 DAO rain TAO

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 02:50 AM

I can get up off the floor without using my hands Posted Image

#3 Mokona

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 05:38 AM

Can I comment on my meditative and chi kung practices even if they aren't Taoist?
Reality is awesome.

#4 Protector

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 10:01 AM

I can lick my elbow NO WAIT DAMIT SO CLOSE

I will never forget you, report button *salutes*

 
Sword cuts in two pieces
Cutting two pieces is easy
Cutting two into one is hard part
You don't cut opponent
It is against universal law
You cut two into one

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#5 ChiDragon

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    Interested in finding and demystify ancient ambiguous ineffable concepts in correlation with modern scientific knowledge.

Posted 09 June 2012 - 10:25 AM

I can stay on the ground for a long time without using my hands...... :lol:
靜觀其變 以靜制動
Beware of the unexpected silently
Handle adversity with calmness

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#6 thelerner

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 11:51 AM

What have you been able to accomplish personally with the current techniques you are using?

How far are you spiritually?
Can you move energy around?
Can you open peoples chakras?
How powerful is the energy that you can build up?
Can you take peoples karma out of them put it into yourself and deal with it?
Then maybe you can say at the end how much further you know you can go with the current Taoist practices out there.



I can get up off the floor without using my hands

Let's see. I can no longer get off the floor without moving my hands, but I can sit quietly.

How far spiritually? So far.. level 6.9 out of infinity.
Open other Chakras? Let'em open there own chakras, lazy bastards.
How powerful is the energy I build? I'm trying to keep it pretty calm these days.
Take in others karma? No by definition its something they have to work through themselves.
How far can my the current Taoist practice take me? Into the moment, no further.

No powers, no abilities, just sitting, standing and walking with a clear quiet mind and getting out of the universes way.

Edited by thelerner, 09 June 2012 - 11:53 AM.

Push hard to get better, become smarter, grow your devotion to the truth, fuel your commitment to beauty, refine your emotional intelligence, hone your dreams, negotiate with your shadow, cure your ignorance, shed your pettiness, heighten your drive to look for the best in people, and soften your heart. A creed from Pronoia

Where we have stopped dancing, singing, being enchanted by stories, or finding comfort in silence is where we have experience the loss of soul. Dancing, singing, storytelling, and silence are the four universal healing salves. ~ Gabrielle Roth

#7 Friend

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 01:07 PM

What have you been able to accomplish personally with the current techniques you are using?

Here are some examples.

How far are you spiritually?

Can you move energy around?

Can you open peoples chakras?

How powerful is the energy that you can build up?

Can you take peoples karma out of them put it into yourself and deal with it?

Then maybe you can say at the end how much further you know you can go with the current Taoist practices out there.

Thanks.

Peace!


Me thinks you want a serious answer, while the other believe that it is for fun.
Difficult is that in Taoist Practise Chakra do not exist in mainstream.

Moving around energy and build up powerful energy do not necessary touch the physical planes. Different system cultivate different energy and some are similiar but not the same, which result in similar results and effects and the need of different techniques.

Spiritually is difficult to answer, when you believe that it is equal to the abillity to tap into wisdom, then one just have to ask oneself if one is happy.

Changing ones Karma is not an easy feat- you may have too high expectation for this board.

Personally many here on this board hinted at their practise by their post, and some are even having personal forums and write back feedback in other post.
So take your time and read the forum.

Peace,
Q

#8 konchog uma

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 02:31 PM

my practice has imbued me with the insight not to answer questions like that.

so they are that effective.

what good would it do you or anyone else to know that i can do above-average things with my life energy? or to know how far along i think i am? the path never ends, even mukta, liberation, or enlightenment is just the beginning of an unfathomably long journey. Not to speak of immortality, which of course is just that same thing.

and how much good would it do me to engage in some kind of discussion about how awesome i am? none at all.

"the wise wear jade in their bellies and rags on their outsides"

not to cut you down, i understand you want to start an interesting and lively topic amongst practitioners, but i am still inclined to voice my opinion. Most extraordinary people with interesting answers keep their practice, their methods, their results, etc secret. And for good reason, both as a matter of historical example, and of common sense.
"All the philosophical theories that exist have been created by the mistaken dualistic minds of human beings. in the realm of philosophy, that which today is considered true, may tomorrow be proved to be false. No one can guarantee a philosophy's validity. Because of this any intellectual way of seeing whatsoever is always partial and relative. The fact is that there is no truth to see or to confirm logically; rather what one needs to do is to discover just how much the mind continually limits itself in a condition of dualism." -Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

#9 Eric23

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 03:11 PM

My practice of Unwinding the Belly, a version of Chi Nei Tsang has relieved me of a bunch of stuff that was stored in my LDT. That, combined with Yin Yoga has allowed me to breathe freely and feel more open.

#10 AstralProjectee

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 03:45 PM

I believe in the Taoist practices. I have respect for Taoists.

But I don't like the attitude that one has to keep these things a secret. I think that is being ignorant of our times in these days. It's not like way back in the day when people would use these things to do evil. Correct me if I am wrong but it seems like a subtle form of arrogant pride. It seems like a Holier than thou attitude. Maybe I am wrong. I use to be like that when I was a Christian years ago. Thank God I am no longer like that.

I would appreciate it if you can give me some reasons why you choose to not talk about your practices, rather that just acting like your holier than me. I know you can come up with some seemingly legitimate reasons but ask your self, is it really important to keep these things a secret in this day and age. I know of people that talk about the things I listed on the Internet and forums and it does not seem like such a secret to them.

Do you all think that John Chang the Taoist master should keep his secrets secrets in this day and age?

Having said all that, I want to know most importantly, how far our current mainstream understanding of Taoism can take us?

Peace!

#11 AstralProjectee

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 04:04 PM

If John Chang truly revealed his secrets, we would be making huge strides in the science of spirituality. But because of his tradition and the control his master had on him we are all still in darkness about the real power that we all have in us. That is mainly the rest of the world. John Chang could empirically prove kundalini and chi power. This would usher in a new age of spirituality and an understanding of science and reality that is much needed in this world today.

Think about it. We could make machines that can tune and heal your chakras. We would be able to efficiently heal and balance our bodies energy systems. In time we should be able to find make ZPE machines that can make unlimited amounts of energy that would transform the world.

But we can't do that because we are not ready. We already have the power of nuclear bombs.

The world will advance the fastest once everything is open-source.

Peace!

Edited by AstralProjectee, 09 June 2012 - 04:06 PM.


#12 konchog uma

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 04:13 PM

But I don't like the attitude that one has to keep these things a secret. I think that is being ignorant of our times in these days. It's not like way back in the day when people would use these things to do evil.


it has nothing to do with the times these days. :) People still use their personal power to do evil btw lol

Correct me if I am wrong but it seems like a subtle form of arrogant pride. It seems like a Holier than thou attitude. Maybe I am wrong. I use to be like that when I was a Christian years ago. Thank God I am no longer like that.

I would appreciate it if you can give me some reasons why you choose to not talk about your practices, rather that just acting like your holier than me. I know you can come up with some seemingly legitimate reasons but ask your self, is it really important to keep these things a secret in this day and age.


it might seem like i am acting holier than you, but that is mistaken. I simply have come across the advice of several masters and traditions, including my own, who advise that one not talk about their progress to others, or the results of their personal practice, or the nature of their inner experience and abilities. To talk about it with ones teacher is enough. I have also had the experience of making a breakthrough in meditation which sustained itself for a couple days until i told my girlfriend, out of love, not pride or arrogance or anything remotely like it, about my experience, at which point i was unable to achieve that state of being (still only have glimpses now) and my spiritual guidance told me unequivocally that it was because i spoke about it. So there's that.

The theory is that ones progress is like a pressure cooker and in order to keep the integrity of it complete, one needs to keep it a secret from others. It is not about good and evil in a moral sense, as you assume. There is also the advice, as muktananda gives in his autobiography, "play of consciousness", that one simply shouldn't compare experiences with others because it is not their business and, as i tried to point out to you by means of questions in the previous post, does nobody any good ultimately. It is really just spiritual materialism, as chogyam trungpa put it, parading ones accomplishments around and saying "oh i see these color lights" or "i have this state of bliss when i sit in emptiness". Try to think of an answer to my questions, who is it helping to display ones inner accomplishments around? and conversely, who could be injured by thinking about a supremely personal and individual matter in comparative terms? Ones inner journey is ultimately theirs alone, like birth and death, it happens alone. Failure to respect the sanctity of the spiritual ascent is cautioned about by taoists, buddhists, yogis, shaivites, my own teacher (although he's a ninja and they're used to keeping everything secret) and everyone i have ever read a sincere and qualified exposition of progress on ones personal path from!!

in spite of the conclusions you have jumped to, there isn't a shred of my being that believes i am holier than you. Such insinuations sour the tone of this conversation. Perhaps it could be said that by thinking you are privy to my inner workings you find yourself on some similar pedestal?!? but that is not the point. the point, that one is advised to secrecy about ones inner work, has been made, by others before me, and by me again now. Others on this site will attest to it, and i stand by it as a matter of personal experience.

I know of people that talk about the things I listed on the Internet and forums and it does not seem like such a secret to them.


perhaps they haven't been given, or have failed to heed the advice mentioned above? are you trying to say that masters of this age and past ages are wrong because fools talk about their spiritual accomplishments on the internet? That seems like a flimsy argument.

Do you all think that John Chang the Taoist master should keep his secrets secrets in this day and age?


yes. in spite of whiny westerners and their insistence i think he should follow the guidance of his headmaster spirit and his deceased master and the line of his lineage. Any serious practitioner shares that responsibility to the lineage they belong to.

Having said all that, I want to know most importantly, how far our current mainstream understanding of Taoism can take us?


understanding will take you so far, and then you will need practice to carry you the rest of the way. The practices are out there for all to see, and when one has sufficiently carried them out, and is ready for a teacher of a higher echelon, that teacher will appear in their lives. That is how it works. So mainstream daoism can take you far enough. It isn't the practices that are secret. Its the personal manifestations, the subjective and comparative part of that is warned against.
"All the philosophical theories that exist have been created by the mistaken dualistic minds of human beings. in the realm of philosophy, that which today is considered true, may tomorrow be proved to be false. No one can guarantee a philosophy's validity. Because of this any intellectual way of seeing whatsoever is always partial and relative. The fact is that there is no truth to see or to confirm logically; rather what one needs to do is to discover just how much the mind continually limits itself in a condition of dualism." -Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

#13 Birch

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 04:21 PM

Hello Astralprojectee (wow, name!)

I would like to answer your questions, but would you mind if I asked some too?

---snip---

How far are you spiritually? - What do you mean? I take 'spiritual' to mean 'non-material' and that can be both 'thought/mind/imagination' as much as it can be 'other' stuff

Can you move energy around? - Within what I consider 'my field' which is just a foot or so beyond my physical body - yes.

Can you open peoples chakras? - No, although I do reckon I can 'tell' more or less where a person 'is' - chakras are focal points IMO/IME but the 'spread' is variable.


How powerful is the energy that you can build up? - Personal, not much at all:-) But if I remember where I'm 'plugged in' I guess that's quite some:-) [/b]

Can you take peoples karma out of them put it into yourself and deal with it? - No. And why would I?

Then maybe you can say at the end how much further you know you can go with the current Taoist practices out there. - I'm an extremely 'rotten' Taoist. There's all kinds of stuff I could do and don't.
"Chi is free!"- "Don't give your chi to your practice" Both unknown, if you know where these come from, let me know!

#14 Protector

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 04:30 PM

When speaking of power, people notice that wit is mightier then the brawn
It is like soft and hard comparison, a bit of wit can win against a higher number of power
To win against the mind, the body must be a lot more powerful
If you image soft and hard as weights on a scale, a little bit of wit would weight as much as a big lump of muscle
You might get better results by combining the two but there is something that weights a lot more then even the two combined

Wit can't really be measured but the direct hard fighting power can
It can be shown by muscle or hidden behind clothes
Wit can be shown by being hidden and hidden by being shown
People who just blab all day don't seem to be as smart as people who only show up at the right time to do the right thing
Tho I'm blabbering right now, maybe I'm tricking you somehow and the trick is the trick in itself

The ultimate strongest power is the one that is hidden
Don't show how strong you are and someone weaker might approach you thinking they are stronger
Don't show how smart you are and you can trick everyone
The ultimate strongest third power after wit and brawn is called a secret

You might scare off your weaker enemies by showing them you true power but that will attract the stronger enemies as well
Strong enemies also mean higher expectations from the weaker enemies and sometimes death

This adds a lot more meaning to the popular saying "loose the ego"
You think you are telling the truth when you finally reveal your power but you might be even lying to yourself
When you say how strong you are, you are showing how weak you are and what you say to yourself might mean something different to the ones you say it
That is the big difference when revealing your progress, you don't know yourself where you are and you get others lost

I will never forget you, report button *salutes*

 
Sword cuts in two pieces
Cutting two pieces is easy
Cutting two into one is hard part
You don't cut opponent
It is against universal law
You cut two into one

GRYFFINDOR

 

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It would mean a lot to me if you read this.


#15 Friend

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 07:00 AM

But I don't like the attitude that one has to keep these things a secret. I think that is being ignorant of our times in these days. It's not like way back in the day when people would use these things to do evil. Correct me if I am wrong but it seems like a subtle form of arrogant pride. It seems like a Holier than thou attitude. Maybe I am wrong. I use to be like that when I was a Christian years ago. Thank God I am no longer like that.


Secret.... Precious things are rarely handed out freely. Wisdom is often confuse with Ignorance. The intent to do something good may lead to worse things and I heard a saying that those who had good intention was tyrannic in history.
Wanting to be an hero means you also wish for situation one can be hero, and this situation are those of catastrophe and disaster.

I see nothing wrong with a Christian. When you have understood the Christians teaching you would have let go of Dogma. The Christian Saints had done this and they were free of Dogma. What is cultivated is kindness and the rituals are fool of meanining in the esoteric.

Also the mainstream things have their secret sides. Because when one ask for more, someone who has undertaken the steps see that you if you have developed the awareness
and do not tell you because you can not perceive the things to have the gain.
It is a time a teacher come into the seminar and project a big sphere but nobody can see this so he teach only what is mainstream but he would have teached anybody
who could see the big sphere, secrets. You must know there is a lot of offer,
but each offer is also a test for readiness to receive.

And the internet is full of techniques which are meant to be secret.
Also the techniques have secrets inbuild which can be unlocked by progress, time and effort.

Demanding things is as well to be holier than others in my view. People have their freedom to decide if they want or do not want to share.

Do you all think that John Chang the Taoist master should keep his secrets secrets in this day and age?

I think it is up to John Chang to decide. Else I remember he was Christian
and the techniques are not Taoist.

Having said all that, I want to know most importantly, how far our current mainstream understanding of Taoism can take us?

The current mainstream understanding is superficial. The techniques in the mainstream with easy access through, books and internet are not, some see the silver around but inside there is a "gold mine in an other universe". And the deeper meanings come when it is like Chuck Norris joke:
"Chuck Norris do not read books, he stare at the book so the book tell him what he want to know" ... only this is not a joke, the exercise will reveal gradual step by step things that are not written. And if the potential and talent is low even a high level technique is just some callinestics and 40 years still has lead to nothing.

"A 100 meter high tree can not grow to its seize when the ground is not fertille enough to let it grow so high in nature. But human are clever they will find different ground or fertilze it."

Peace,
Q

#16 Master Logray

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 08:02 AM

To give you a legitimate answer, the eastern tradition is much unlike that of western. Aleister Crowley explained that Magick works like science, how much input, how much output. Things work on formula just like natural science.

Eastern traditions are quite personalized. They are inner workings, feelings, personal experiences. Most of them could not be easily described, not to mention measured and compared. In meditations, students are expected to ignore all phenomenons (e.g. ESP). Paying attention to the phenomenons, which is different for every person in different stage, is full of perils. As anamatva says, it is a journey alone, because each person's journey is different.

For real masters, they tend to keep a low profile to keep out of troubles and avoid being caught with too much attentions. To be humble and humility are basic requirements.




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