I'm just wondering. . .

[三江源]

Hi!

According to Liao "into the spiritual dimension". But they can return in our dimension (as a visible person) and go back again whenever they wish.

 

I cant express how much I *heart* this.

[Aetherous]

Take it where?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZSIz0GW1oM

 

To where you've always been, always are, always will be. Just my view.

Edited November 25, 2012 by turtle shell

[Wells]

I cant express how much I *heart* this.

 

Btw, contrary to what anamatva was saying about similar tibetan goals, Liao is very explicit that you reach that goal of becoming a "saint" while being alive and not in the process of dying or so!

Well, could anybody think of a more attractive fate than this? I mean, being able to switch back and forth between our dimension and some fairyland-dimension of the immortals? Not having to die, staying alive as some kind of physical light-being forever.

Becoming a "saint", fairy, Dr. Manhatten, Blessed Virgin Mary or whatever analogy you like!

All you have to do is raising the frequency and amplitude of your energy wave function to a certain level with Temple Style Taichi Nei Kung Training or a similar system. If you have the right training it's only a matter of the amount of dedicated work and time you are able or willing to invest. I don't know how many persons in history have achieved that goal but I believe Liao (and similar stories of other cultures as tibetan) that it's possible.

[Imperial]

Is it possible to change our physical features when manifesting a form to appear in the mortal world? It'd be awesome to transform!

 

P.S.: Thanks for introducing me to the books! I was also wondering about online sources. XD

Edited November 25, 2012 by Imperial

[effilang]

Can this be achieved after becoming a spiritual immortal, or are they separate achievements?

 

This^ - Anyone?

 

In one method the vibration of the energy body becomes too refined to be contained within the gross physical and leaves the shell. In the other method the physical body is dissolved and the energy body remains.

 

I've read in several books by different masters that as the energy body's vibration increases, it becomes challenging to keep the immortal soul in the shell as it feels restricted by the limitations of the coarse body. Most even advise that during the initial journeys of the immortal soul outside the body the one must be vigilant to bring it back inside or it will naturally refuse to merge itself back into such a low vibration.

 

 

[Wells]

Is it possible to change our physical features when manifesting a form to appear in the mortal world? It'd be awesome to transform!

 

P.S.: Thanks for introducing me to the books! I was also wondering about online sources. XD

 

Haha, I have no idea! I tell you when I reach that level!

imo, you should then achieve full control over your personal energy (including the energy of the matter of your body). So maybe changing appearance could be possible!

[Imperial]

It'd be cool!

 

Even though to reach immortality by changing our vibrations and frequency of our energy, how do we become immortal like that? Do we still have our consciousness in our energy?

[Wells]

It'd be cool!

 

Even though to reach immortality by changing our vibrations and frequency of our energy, how do we become immortal like that? Do we still have our consciousness in our energy?

 

Sadly Liao doesn't explain in detail these issues in his book "Tao: The Way Of God".

[Imperial]

Hm. . . I understand about transffering our consciousness into a spirit body, but I don't know if our consciousness in a high-vibrating energy can hold. Maybe it's the opposite; like we can still retain consciousness in the freely moving energy and control it?

[effilang]

 

 

Haha, I have no idea! I tell you when I reach that level!

imo, you should then achieve full control over your personal energy (including the energy of the matter of your body). So maybe changing appearance could be possible!

 

There are some accounts of shape-shifting in those reports.

 

http://www.daoistmagic.com/info.php?i=3826

http://www.daoistmagic.com/info.php?i=2191

http://texts.00.gs/Daoist_Magical_Transformation_Skills,_I.htm

 

[Wells]

Hm. . . I understand about transffering our consciousness into a spirit body, but I don't know if our consciousness in a high-vibrating energy can hold. Maybe it's the opposite; like we can still retain consciousness in the freely moving energy and control it?

 

You just transform the already existing energy of your whole being.

This energy is the base/source/reason for your Mind. This won't change.

[三江源]

Our conscousness has to transform. As light as a feather.

 

Imagine your consciousness, now, to be as light as a feather, and crystal clear, and wholly luminous.

 

Good excercise to practice.. start with the lightness.. the other qualities follow.

 

It's density we are shifting, iow, heaviness we are relinquishing.

[Imperial]

I also heard that you need to convert all your energy into pure Yang. What's the difference between pure Yang and Yin energy?

[三江源]

hi cat. why imagine, but rather, command?

interesting , useful question. Many nuances according to what it is you wish to cultivate at any given time.Light evocation of imagine. The power base of command just isnt necessary with regard to cultivating light.Light touch is all that is required and what needs to be cultivated.On a practical note.. any time you command you are inviting subservience and therefore resistance.Imagination holds tremendous power and it is a power of creation and invitation.Command is more to do with summoning and wielding.Generally in taoism the touch needs to be lightened, the footfall needs to be lightened.. the mind alighting on each thing it perceives needs to to alight without weight.What one would have to be aware of would be : from whence do I find what is required in order to issue command. And why do I imagine I need to command rather than invite. And from whence does my ability to imagine actually stem?

[Wells]

I also heard that you need to convert all your energy into pure Yang.

 

...at least not in Temple Style Taichi Nei Kung!

 

 

What's the difference between pure Yang and Yin energy?

 

That's...complicated! Every system seems to have it's own conception about Yin and Yang!

[konchog uma]

Btw, contrary to what anamatva was saying about similar tibetan goals, Liao is very explicit that you reach that goal of becoming a "saint" while being alive and not in the process of dying or so!

 

sorry for the misunderstanding. I was trying to express that those goals are not similar. The daoist goal involves living forever and the tibetan goal involves death. hope i didnt confuse anyone

[Imperial]

sorry for the misunderstanding. I was trying to express that those goals are not similar. The daoist goal involves living forever and the tibetan goal involves death. hope i didnt confuse anyone

Do you think one can have the body of a Taoist Immortal and the mind of an enlightened Buddha? I mean it sounds like a contradiction because in Buddhism, there is the concept of no-self, but I just want to test it out in this lifetime of mine, being an Enlightened Immortal. XD

Edited November 25, 2012 by Imperial

[Wells]

Do you think one can have the body of a Taoist Immortal and the mind of an enlightened Buddha? I mean it sounds like a contradiction because in Buddhism, there is the concept of no-self, but I just want to test it out in this lifetime of mine, being an Enlightened Immortal. XD

 

In Temple Style Taichi Nei Kung, which is practical Taoism, when the frequency of your energy (which must have a very high amplitude also) matches the ultra-high frequency of Tao, you connect to it. You can consider this as taoist equivalent to "Enlightenment".

This is a declared goal in Temple Style. Liao defines "Tao" as a ultrafine net of conscious energy that permeates the universe.

[Imperial]

Hm. . . I was thinking of like the nirvanic state-of-mind type of enlightenment.

[Ish]

as to the question about the tibetans vanishing into light, thats called rainbow body and is different than immortality practices. rainbow body dissolution into light (leaving hair and nails) only happens upon death. In fact its considered the most elevated way to die. Then depending on ones mastery of dream states and the bardo, one can go where they wish to be reborn, so in a sense, there is that aspect of immortality of the soul, but the general tendancy of tibetan buddhists is to look at extreme longevity and immortality practices as a sort of self-clinging, or ego exercise.

 

if you look into it you should find info. Read Chogyal Namkhai Norbu's "The Crystal and the Way of Light" for more info but thats the only firsthand account i can think of. He writes about a guy under house arrest whose progress in the rainbow body death was disturbed by authorities who said that they went into his room but he was tiny like a child, they were kinda freaked out so they went back in a couple days with some more men, but all that was left was hair and nails. CNN writes about several cases of rainbow body he witnessed firsthand, some were people related to him, very good book, highly recommended

 

From my reading of Heart Drops of Dharmakaya it seems that the highest level of liberation is attaining the complete Jalus before death, with complete resorption of the body.

So they can essentially complete the process and dissolve the body when they want, after this the result sounds very similar to the highest level Taoist immortals, they can appear in any realm as they choose to help beings.

 

So isn't this very similar to the process described in Taoist Yoga? The physical body is either left behind or transmuted.

[konchog uma]

Do you think one can have the body of a Taoist Immortal and the mind of an enlightened Buddha? I mean it sounds like a contradiction because in Buddhism, there is the concept of no-self, but I just want to test it out in this lifetime of mine, being an Enlightened Immortal. XD

 

many of the buddhas and deities in buddhism live basically forever... after shakyamuni's "death" he continued to manifest as a spirit or sambogakaya emanation.. there is definitely some overlap between buddhism and immortality

 

and to answer your question directly, i dont see any contradiction between longevity as a daoist immortal and enlightenment in the buddhist sense

[Imperial]

http://internalart.tripod.com/home/immortality.htm

I wonder if that link is a good site to use for practicing. I think I can learn how to the do qigong and meditation exercises online. What do you guys think?

[konchog uma]

i didnt look at the site cause i dont have time right now

 

but be careful practicing energy arts without a teacher!!

[Ish]

From my reading of Heart Drops of Dharmakaya it seems that the highest level of liberation is attaining the complete Jalus before death, with complete resorption of the body.

So they can essentially complete the process and dissolve the body when they want, after this the result sounds very similar to the highest level Taoist immortals, they can appear in any realm as they choose to help beings.

 

So isn't this very similar to the process described in Taoist Yoga? The physical body is either left behind or transmuted.

 

To clarify here's a section from "The Crystal and the Way of Light",

 

A practitioner who manifests this realization cannot really be said to have `died', at all, in the ordinary sense of the word because he or she still remains spontaneously active as a principle of being in a Body of Light. The spontaneous activity of such an individual will be directed for the benefit of others, and he or she is actually visible to someone in a physical body who has sufficient clarity.

 

But a practitioner who perfects and completes the fourth level of the Thodgal visions does not manifest death at all, but while still living gradually becomes invisible to those who have normal karmic vision. This level of realization is called the `Great Transfer', and this is the realization that Padmasambhava and Vimalamitra manifested. Essentially, the realizations of the Great Transfer and the Body of Light are one and the same; the only difference is that those who attain the Great Transfer do not have to go through death in the clinical sense in order to move from manifestation in the material plane to manifestation in the plane of the essence of elements. These two modes of realization are particular to the practice of Dzogchen

 

Chogyal Namkhai Norbu. The Crystal and the Way of Light: Sutra, Tantra and Dzogchen (p. 162). Kindle Edition.

 

 

So if one reaches the 3rd stage of Thogal then they will dissolve into Jalus upon "death", but reaching the 4th level one goes through the Great Transference while alive as described above.

 

Thanks anamatva for recommending this book.

[konchog uma]

you're most welcome ish!